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Cakewalk Sonar Goes Belly Up

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TheHound
Posts: 66
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2016 10:26 pm

Re: Cakewalk Sonar Goes Belly Up

Postby TheHound » Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:56 pm

Starship Krupa wrote:
Mark Bliss wrote:The truly sad news is that its such a low growth market that its not worth it going forward.
Simple business realities.

Electric guitar sales numbers aren't too encouraging either. Between the pressure created by the quality improvement of low cost producers and the marketing pressures of big box store economics, its no wonder Gibson is looking elsewhere.


I don't think it's a sign of anything other than a poorly-run, overextended company's inability to keep a well-respected product viable. And if they couldn't do it, they should have spun it off rather than killing it.

Gibson under Juszkiewicz has bought up and killed other brands, like Slingerland. I've just been sitting back watching for the company's inevitable stumble and fall. What is a shame is when good, potentially viable products like Cakewalk SONAR get taken down with them.

This is also why I will never, ever, if I can avoid it, buy software on a lifetime subscription basis that presumes that the company and development will go on in perpetuity.


Gibson is in deep trouble for a lot of reasons. Their flagship guitar the Les Paul is being out classed by other models. It's heavy, too much bottom end, has tuning issues and the headstock angle is wrong which causes tuning issues. Instead of making their necks like the Epiphone they continued with the same flawed design and tried to fix it with this silly motorized contraption and we thought the Germans were the only people who over engineered stuff.

CEOs rarely know much about the companies that get paid to run.... run into the ground. There is also a glut of instruments that out live people.

Companies need to be consistent and innovative without trying to reinvent th wheel.

Corporatism is ruining a lot more than musical stuff. You can't even buy a decent washing machine any longer other than speed queen.

Have DAWs reached their zenith? What more do we need to make music? If a great musician/composer/producer creates a piece of music, he or she can create it and have it com out great on anything with or without all the bells and whistles.

I like the "feel' of Mixcraft for what I do. Just keep improving effects, virtual instruments and loops. Keep it stable and easy to use.

For what I do, a DAW is a tool same as something like like PhotoShoppe. It is a digital studio same as photoshoppe is a digital dark room and when you think about it some of the best music was recorded and mixed on tape, played on vinyl and listened to on speakers.

starise
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:07 am
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Re: Cakewalk Sonar Goes Belly Up

Postby starise » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:19 am

Well Cakewalk by Bandlab is back in the game. If one can stomach downloading the Bandlab app which can BTW be disabled on future startup you can get the program for free. It really isn't a difficult thing to do.

Quite a surprise move to many that an investor would buy it and then give it away. I suspect so that they can later offer add ons which would be optional.I miss having the Adaptive limiter that was included in the Platinum Gibson version. Still...you aren't lacking much in the most recent version of the program and you get a lot. If you like Mixcraft though why learn another program? I jump between programs for different reasons and have used Cakewalk for years. Mixcraft is a good "all rounder" for the home studio enthusiast and beyond and is easier to get up and running on fast, especially for the novice/beginner.
Intel 5820K O.C. 4.4ghz,
3 x Samsung SATA III 500gb SSD,Win 10 64bit, Presonus Firetube Studio
Laptop HP Omen i7 16gb 2/sdd with Focusrite interface.
CbB, Studio One, Mixcraft 8 Pro, Ableton Live 10
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shayneoneill
Posts: 21
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:35 am

Re: Cakewalk Sonar Goes Belly Up

Postby shayneoneill » Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:00 am

starise wrote:Well Cakewalk by Bandlab is back in the game. If one can stomach downloading the Bandlab app which can BTW be disabled on future startup you can get the program for free. It really isn't a difficult thing to do.

Quite a surprise move to many that an investor would buy it and then give it away. I suspect so that they can later offer add ons which would be optional.I miss having the Adaptive limiter that was included in the Platinum Gibson version. Still...you aren't lacking much in the most recent version of the program and you get a lot. If you like Mixcraft though why learn another program? I jump between programs for different reasons and have used Cakewalk for years. Mixcraft is a good "all rounder" for the home studio enthusiast and beyond and is easier to get up and running on fast, especially for the novice/beginner.


Its been an interesting time. I'm pleased so far with the progress. Bandlab seem to be actually actively developing it, which is spectacular news, and I believe their model is going to be a sort of app store for plugins and the like. I note most of the third party plugins that came with Sonar platinum are removed , including that sweeeeeeeet Rhodes piano sim Lounge lizard which is an absolutely amazing sounding instrument, but now needs to be purchased, something I'm going to do as it really is great.

Sonar isn't really a competitor to Mixcraft. Its more targetted at the Protools/Cubase crowd who need huge amounts of features for running a full time studio, things like SMPTE and all that good stuff.

Mixcraft seems to me going after Logic Pros market (imho) who want big instrument libraries and easy and creative workflow. Logic does have a lot of features too, although apple took out the big one for me, the slave server one (why??????????!!!!!) which is a total necessity for film composers who often need to run huge workloads to do orchestral stuff. Vienna ensemble pro provides that functionality but it isn't cheap. Note to mixcraft: Go look at the open source (MIT!) NetvST project, and stick that good stuff inside mixcraft. Believe me you'll get instant attention from the composer crowd. Only reaper seems to have anything like this, and its..... well it doesn't seem to work well. Solve that one, and you'll get a LOT of interest
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starise
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Re: Cakewalk Sonar Goes Belly Up

Postby starise » Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:49 am

It's difficult to say how all of this will eventually pan out.

I see the studio for hire people who make their living at mixing as a skeptical bunch who are set in their ways. I realize we can't put them all in on group and say, " yeah they're all like this". I think I can say from my experience which has been to hang around a bunch of these guys that many of them are more technical than musical. Most have a tried and proven system that works for them. Logic or Protools is usually in their toolbox mainly because they either learned on it and their clients requested it because they come in with PT or Logic mixes. A handful of those guys actually prefer to work in another daw so they might track in PT and then mix down in something they like better. They have found that some daws work better for certain things they do. These are the guys that work with a lot of local talent.

The movie or cinematic music ME's are another different bunch. Probably more anal than the first. I mean, many of these guys have degrees in composition or work in professional music circles. So they not only compose well, they know how to put it all together in a daw, usually Cubase or logic. Surprisingly though a few use programs like Reaper if they can get it set up to their liking. Neither of these groups are immune to the "grass is greener" mentality and are always on the lookout for something that might make their job a bit easier, so you might find Cakewalk, Reaper, Mixcraft in their tool chest, who knows? Most of em' play more seriously with Cubase and Logic though. You can blame that on their training and a few famous names who use it.It's kind of like Nike in the ME world. Both groups can get potentially pompous about what they think they know and we don't know lol. Most of them are very qualified to be where they are. To me, aside from a few features that they absolutely need, like the ability to run 200 tracks with a full compliment of software plugins mixed in surround they are just ME's on a larger scale. They might swing those stats around to make you feel like you'll never be able to do that. What they don't tell you is most of the time you really don't need all of that. Mixcraft proves that if you set things up properly and use a few reasonably priced sample libraries you can get similar results.No you're not mixing big budget film, but don't let these guys fool you. They are usually working in a small studio with a few pieces of nice hardware, some decent sample libraries and a powerful computer. That's it.

Since I use my daw more like a tape machine and then act as my own Mixing engineer I don't feel the need or desire to compete on that level. I know I could if someone ponied up the money and gave me a project, but then it might not be as enjoyable any more.

I'm getting long winded here so I'll cut this short- Mixcraft and CbB are probably more than enough for any home studio enthusiast. The fact that they are both PC only means that the design teams only need to focus on one platform. Many musicians and MEs are migrating away from the Mac platform. It's been too little too late for many of them. Higher Mac prices are driving the average musician away. Look at how many buy a five year old Mac just so they can have one. Apple's planned obsolescence, Problems using the recent releases of Cubase on a Mac, the most solid OS ever in Win 10 on PC. more reliable PC hardware than before has led many to stop using their Macs and go PC. I see the future being more this way.
Intel 5820K O.C. 4.4ghz,
3 x Samsung SATA III 500gb SSD,Win 10 64bit, Presonus Firetube Studio
Laptop HP Omen i7 16gb 2/sdd with Focusrite interface.
CbB, Studio One, Mixcraft 8 Pro, Ableton Live 10
https://soundcloud.com/starise


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