Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

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edude15000
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Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by edude15000 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:52 pm

Hello I just got the Waves SSLComp plugin and I tried using the mastering preset within the Stereo (VST3) version of the plugin. It seems to work with playback, but the compressor indicator doesn't work. After closing and reopening Mixcraft or mixing down a song, when I playback the same audio, the output level is extremely quiet or loud compared to before mixing it down or reopening the project (without changing any settings). This only happens with this plugin. I am using Mixcraft Pro 8. I am curious if this is not compatible and want to see if I should try to get my money back for it. It's just a pain cause the output level seems to be so random for some reason and I can't get it to stay at the same level after mixing down.

Also half the time I mixdown, after it gets done, I get like 10 errors of my plugins failing and I get a loud high pitched sound until I close Mixcraft.

JonInc
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by JonInc » Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:01 pm

edude15000 wrote:....
Also half the time I mixdown, after it gets done, I get like 10 errors of my plugins failing and I get a loud high pitched sound until I close Mixcraft.
This could be plugin-related or a feedback loop or ?. Hard to troubleshoot with no info on your setup. Audio interface? What O.S.? Latest build of MC 8?

VST3 tend to be more problematic in some setups. What happens if you try the VST2 version of the plugin?

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Mark Bliss
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Mark Bliss » Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:00 am

edude, assuming you are discussing Waves SSL bus compressor:

I can verify, it is one of many VST3 "plugs full-o-bugs" I have tested. The meter is fubared and the plug in malfunctions regularly. So far the VST2 version is fine however. Don't see where any function or purpose is lost by using VST2 here, but I could be wrong. Whenever a VST3 acts up, try the VST2 version. Problems are so common I usually just choose the latter to start with unless there is good reason to do otherwise.

As to the second problem, don't know if it is directly related or not, but it sounds like more plug in issues.
Just to make sure, as Jon points out, make sure you have the latest build. Otherwise, there may be clues in dropped/disabled plug ins when the problem occurs, or you might try to reproduce with the plug ins removed, adding them back one at a time to try and capture the culprit. Unfortunately, sometimes it seems to be a combination of two or more culprits.

Please let us know what you discover!
Stay in tune, Mark

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edude15000
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by edude15000 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:41 pm

Thanks! Switching to the VST2 plugin made the issues go away. Is there any importance for using VST3 over 2?

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Mark Bliss
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Mark Bliss » Thu Dec 28, 2017 5:23 pm

As I understand the current situation:

The VST3 standard allows for some additional functions or abilities, but for the most part it seems producers aren't yet taking much advantage of it. Even when I don't run into bugs in the VST3 versions, there is no apparent difference in most of what I have tested so far. And in every case where I have discovered a buggy VST3 version, opting for the VST2 version has resulted in a fully functioning plug in, so I have to believe that many producers are just putting out VST3 versions to maintain the appearance they are "up to date"
Some bugs may be host related, I cant be certain, but it seems many of these plugs aren't ready for prime time.

I once read that the VST3 standard included more ability for example to have resizable plug in GUI's, but so far not too many of them are resizable, and I have discovered that there are a few VST2 plugs that are resizable, so I think I was mislead on that aspect......

I also read there was some thing about a difference in memory allocation, but I don't know what to believe right now. I just try to find and "use what works" Which quite often means a VST2 version.

One pertinent example of an exception to some of this is the Melodyne ARA integration into the sound tab, which as I understand it requires use of the VST3 standard. Looks like that one is better sorted than some?
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Starship Krupa
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Starship Krupa » Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:56 pm

Yeah, I've given up on VST3's for now.

They can supposedly do neat things like turn themselves off when they are not processing audio, for less consumption of resources, and multiple instances of the same plug-in can share resources, and VSTi's can have improved I/O, but the developers of the plug-ins have to make use of those features. I have yet to see any plug-in developer advertise that they are making use of the new capabilities that VST3 affords.

The only thing different about them I've noticed is that they seem to crash more often.
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rrichard63
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by rrichard63 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:52 pm

I was under the impression that the main addition in VST3 was explicit support for sidechaining. But most DAWs, including Mixcraft 8, have built-in workarounds that enable sidechaining in VST2 plugins that have a second input.

As already mentioned, the ARA protocol used by Melodyne (and very few, if any, others) is new in VST3.

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Mark Bliss
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Mark Bliss » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:03 pm

Curious, I revisited the article I had read before ever seeing a VST3, and it appears all the above is for the most part, correct, and then there is even more.
https://www.steinberg.net/en/company/te ... /vst3.html

(second half of the page outlines it)
It is intriguing and presents some cool potential for the future IMO. I cant say how much of the teething pains so far are poor coding on the plug in producers part, or possible implementation difficulties on the part of host program developers. I would expect its some combination thereof. In the meantime, I try them, and if they aren't ready for prime time, simply revert to VST2 versions or alternatives.

I am not certain, but I suspect some of the new features in the plug ins like iZotope Ozone8 and Neutron, where they have modules that intercommunicate, even across tracks, at almost an eerie "smart" or AI level- must be taking advantage of VST3's potential too.

Either way, it makes me think there is even more amazing things on the horizon that will present even more amazing opportunities for even the most humble of users. We live in interesting times! 8)

"Alexa? What's the best EQ setting for this track?"
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rrichard63
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by rrichard63 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:17 pm

Mark Bliss wrote: ... I am not certain, but I suspect some of the new features in the plug ins like iZotope Ozone8 and Neutron, where they have modules that intercommunicate, even across tracks, at almost an eerie "smart" or AI level- must be taking advantage of VST3's potential too. ...
I don't think communication between different instances of the same or related plugins does depend on either VST standard. I think developers use the same techniques for inter-process communication that are used by all software.
Last edited by rrichard63 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mark Bliss
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Mark Bliss » Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:37 pm

Yeah, I have no idea. Way out of my range of understanding.
Blue Cat gain (VST2) communicates between incidences. What I am seeing in this new stuff is way beyond that level. Even if I don't have a complete grasp of some of it......

I don't know what it takes to make the stuff work, but I do have a strong sense that its a game changer and a sign of things to come.

*Yep, I just took a quick look. Available as VST2 and 3, 32 and 64 bit. So it was a bad guess. Crazy stuff their doin'
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Rski
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Re: Waves SSLComp Stereo (VST3) Plugin compatibility?

Post by Rski » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:00 am

About a year ago I bought two Waves plugins. Recently I noticed that the J37 tape emulator does justice to a mix when played at moderate volumes. When assigning my many plugins in groups, I chosen the VST3 with the J37, suddenly some erratic looping happened with MC8, then it would kick out.
Dumped the VST3 version and loaded the standard version, no issue with that plugin. MC8 does prompt when it won't load the VST3 version, no biggie.

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