Question to people who make money with their songs

[Mab098157]

"I am not going to provide the link to my favorite example of this, because I find it quite tasteless, but how else do you explain an at best mediocre amatuer musician who has posted a dozen (or so) videos posted of herself playing an acoustic guitar and singing cover songs with each video approaching 18 million!!! hits....... All you apparently really need is an exaggerated push up bra and set the camera angle up to make the most of the view.
Try to beat that tactic. - Mark Bliss

I want to try an get her to perform one of my songs!

[GovernmentMule]

"I am not going to provide the link to my favorite example of this, because I find it quite tasteless, but how else do you explain an at best mediocre amatuer musician who has posted a dozen (or so) videos posted of herself playing an acoustic guitar and singing cover songs with each video approaching 18 million!!! hits....... All you apparently really need is an exaggerated push up bra and set the camera angle up to make the most of the view.
Try to beat that tactic. - Mark Bliss"


Quit discriminating against the tasteless!!

Actually I think I know who it is, if it is on Youtube.

[CRAZY6STRINGS]

I've never cared about making lots of money with my CDs.

I make about 20 to take with me to my gigs. I sell them at $10.00 a pop.
If I sell 10 CDs...I've had a great money day. At 4 gigs (2 to 4 hours) in a month ($85.00 per hour = appx. $700.00) plus 10 CDs a gig ($400.00)...that's about $1100.00 -/+ $200.00)

I can't live off that but it more than pays my mortgage and vehicle fuel. Not bad for a handful of gigs.

[martinweeks]

I might suggest that the fact is that many people lack the objectivity to grasp the difference between income and profit, and that it often contributes to the frequency of which they find themselves in debt, struggling with finances and unable to buy the things they need.... much less want. (Also two often confused objectives.)

I can vouch for that comment. (lol!)

Marty

[Mark Bliss]

Actually I think I know who it is, if it is on Youtube.

Its certainly not that hard to find, and it's not that bad. I just got annoyed at my last attempt to discuss the phenomenon, when it instantly turned into a revisit to middle school comments. Life is too short.

I make about 20 to take with me to my gigs. I sell them at $10.00 a pop.
If I sell 10 CDs...I've had a great money day. At 4 gigs (2 to 4 hours) in a month ($85.00 per hour = appx. $700.00) plus 10 CDs a gig ($400.00)...that's about $1100.00 -/+ $200.00)

There we go, finally!
As I assumed, live performance is key, but is $400 a common gig? (honestly dont know, been far far away from all that for about 35 years.....
Of course if its a band, its divided up....
And your $85 an hour figure ignores all expenses, gear investement, travel, time, so theres some figures missing.
And $10 CD's sound good, if you can move enough to make it worthwhile. How much time and effort are you investing into producing and creating them?
My business affords very little spare time, and what little time I have away from it comes at a premium, at least to me.........
But still, your description by far beats some of the stories I have heard lately. Hey, I have an acquaintance who is a pretty good one person folk/classic rock acoustic act, and he does a free weekly weekend lunch gig just to get out of the house!

Thinking more on this whole topic in general, another thought......
What to make of not just unknown bedroom producers, but often well known, even Grammy nominated (and awarded) producers more and more jumping into the game of selling (and giving away) tips and tutorials sharing and teaching what they do?

[martinweeks]

I've never cared about making lots of money with my CDs.

I make about 20 to take with me to my gigs. I sell them at $10.00 a pop.
If I sell 10 CDs...I've had a great money day. At 4 gigs (2 to 4 hours) in a month ($85.00 per hour = appx. $700.00) plus 10 CDs a gig ($400.00)...that's about $1100.00 -/+ $200.00)

I can't live off that but it more than pays my mortgage and vehicle fuel. Not bad for a handful of gigs.

My point exactly. Plus the advantage that along the way if you're keeping your "biz head" straight, you make liaisons and connections that can lead to better things. Example: Many many years back I was doing a simple short order cook gig at a small "Jazz Music" joint. For the record: I DON'T PLAY JAZZ. just love the music. However, occasionally I would sit in with the house band and play some harmonica with the band. I would also bring my acoustic guitar and occasionally play a few songs while the band was on break. One day the vocalist for this band said, "hey you should go downtown to "Tobacco Road" and check out my husband. He's the drummer in their house band. The folks in this jazz band were the leading Dean's of the U of Miami School of Jazz and the U of M Jazz Orchestra was a direct off shoot of the Dizzy Gilespie Jazz Orchestra. The band at Tobacco Road was Iko Iko. From that simple sit in nothing gig led to me meeting and playing with Kenny Neal of New Orleans, The Mavericks, Bobby Keyes and Ronnie Wood of the Rolling Stones, The band War, and many others. I wound up (over several years time) doing studio work, referral gigs from these folks when they were over booked and so on. All this from simply "networking" (and being honest about my limitations) with people in the biz. So again...leverage your skills and talent to earn the money...don't focus on "oh if I make a record it will make me rich." That's bullshit. In the real world of entertainment that does not fly.

Another example (not me) is the band "Living Colour" their big break came when Keith and Mick of the Stones saw their act at a club somewhere. They asked the band to be the opening act in their next tour. These guys (M & K) are notorious for just picking up local folks for their projects if they like the groove. The harmonica solo on "Miss You" was from some local New York Street Musician. And so on. Remember man, music is a magical force that cannot be controlled no matter what Sony Music and Google may think. The one solid rule of all of this, is DON'T SELL YOUR MUSIC SHORT. It's always an art first and a profit (maybe) second.

Given my current financial circumstances I might spend the next ten years working with MC, and experimenting with samplers, synths, auditioning different mics, playing different guitars etc, and nothing will happen. Or some magical coincidence of events might just drop in on me and everything will change. It's happened to me enough times in my life to give me absolute faith in music (not me) as a force to be reckoned with. My fiancee is an amazing wordsmith. She never knew till one day this past year that she could do this. That was the spark that launched me all over again, because I'm rather good at arrangements. From that point is when I found Mixcraft and just love the manner in which this company teaches folks like you and me how to elevate our mixing skills to something much better than I was doing before. And I used to have a great home "Hardware" recording studio, so this was not new to me, just never properly developed. Now it's becoming an all powerful force all over again, and I know it's just a matter of time before the next great thing will happen. Don't know what it is, but I keep on with this.

Keep on trucking, gigging, and working to perfect your craft. In the end that's the real profit.

Marty

[Mark Bliss]

Interesting example, Living Colour. Quick blast to "fame" but where did they go so quickly?
Appeared to me they fizzled just about as quickly as they appeared. Perhaps in part due to the fact they could not pull off performing their big signature first hit convincingly playing live on their big tour? What worked in the studio and sounded good on the radio wasnt reproducible live.......
Saw them play twice that year. It wasn't good........ Apparently it wasn't just me.

[CRAZY6STRINGS]

[quote="Mark BlissThere we go, finally!
As I assumed, live performance is key, but is $400 a common gig? (honestly dont know, been far far away from all that for about 35 years.....
Of course if its a band, its divided up....
And your $85 an hour figure ignores all expenses, gear investement, travel, time, so theres some figures missing.
And $10 CD's sound good, if you can move enough to make it worthwhile. How much time and effort are you investing into producing and creating them?
[/quote]

First off, I am not in a band. And the $400. is for the sale of CDs only...IF, I sell 40 of them in a month. IF!
My gig fee is $85.00 per hour..and your are right, expenses are taken out of that. But still, I'm making more playing alone than a bar band does...and in much nicer environments (outdoors at wineries). And I can choose when and where I want to play. I'm so spoiled now that I could never be in a band again. I sure don't miss the drama.

I think my reality is, I break even. At the end of a year, after expenses, I have money leftover. But, that means updated equipment and guitar strings in bulk. Since I also get a great tip in a case of fine premium wine after each gig at the winery, It more than pays the fuel costs..heh heh heh.

I do all the production in my home. I have a CD printer (it does not do the quality of silk screen), I do the jewel case booklet and artwork ( I use the best glossy double sided paper), and I do all my own production and mastering. I don't think its at top professional standards...but its pretty good. Which is why I only charge $10.00.

The main thing is...I'm happy with what I make in a year. I'm retired...and I could go crazy and try to make it BIG...and I've thought about shopping my tunes but, I don't write the kind of music that's popular. And I don't want to go back to work...and as it has been said in this thread...the music business is a beast...and will take a lot if not all your energy.

But, you never know. You could put a song on YT and be an overnight star. I buy 4 lotto tickets a month instead.

[outteh]

Great philosophy! Do what you want and enjoy!

[geo524]

I am wondering how to make money with my music. I know some people make cd's and them market them, but I am no wheres near making a cd. I am the type of musician that makes many pieces, but has trouble bringing these ideas into full songs. I am currently working on several different songs, trying to make them complete.

My question is, how can somebody make money off of their songs if they don't have enough to make a cd and make money that way? Like, lets say somebody made one really nice song, and it was one of them one hit wonders. Is it possible to make money off of just one really good song?

You can license your music to Film, TV, Commercials, Video Games, Corporate, etc... and earn some cash on the side.

[Mark Bliss]

........I think my reality is, I break even. At the end of a year, after expenses, I have money leftover........
The main thing is...I'm happy with what I make in a year. I'm retired...and I could go crazy and try to make it BIG...and I've thought about shopping my tunes but, I don't write the kind of music that's popular. And I don't want to go back to work...and as it has been said in this thread...the music business is a beast...and will take a lot if not all your energy.

I think thats a good, accurate honest response. And doing better than many I think.
Many years ago we did the "dragging $3000 worth of gear 150 miles to make $50 dollars" bit until we were burned out. Kept telling ourselves it was fun. Then one day it sunk in that it wasn't. We would work day jobs, and scrounge up some used gear, pool resources to replace something like a worn out old tape delay (that I wish I had today for some reason.....) and drag our broke tired butts home in the wee hours, only to have to get up and go to work. Yeah, fun.

[Mark Bliss]

You can license your music to Film, TV, Commercials, Video Games, Corporate, etc... and earn some cash on the side.

I was hoping you would pop in and share some of your experience. I think this is an interesting angle personally, and there's may different niche/styles from cinematic to jingles.

I meant to add this to clarify one of my previous replies about CDBaby and iTunes, etc.
As I understand it, it is in part, a subscription service that distributes your content over all the common routes, and takes care of any payments, so you get one monthly check instead of having to keep track of everything your self.

Major affiliations:

Clients.png (64.93 KiB) Viewed 7404 times

[marc32123]

[/quote]You can license your music to Film, TV, Commercials, Video Games, Corporate, etc... and earn some cash on the side.[/quote]

So how would I go about that though? I have never done any research at all into it, can you give me an idea of how it works?

[geo524]

You can license your music to Film, TV, Commercials, Video Games, Corporate, etc... and earn some cash on the side.

I was hoping you would pop in and share some of your experience. I think this is an interesting angle personally, and there's may different niche/styles from cinematic to jingles.

I meant to add this to clarify one of my previous replies about CDBaby and iTunes, etc.
As I understand it, it is in part, a subscription service that distributes your content over all the common routes, and takes care of any payments, so you get one monthly check instead of having to keep track of everything your self.

Major affiliations:

Clients.png

Hi Mark,

Each music licensing library has their own specific policies for payment. Some are monthly, some only pay out twice a year and some pay on a quarterly basis. I can't speak for all of them but the licensing companies I've been affiliated with over the years all do a thorough job of tracking sales and other data pertaining to the uses of your material. IMHO Audiosparx is one of the best in this area as you have access to run individual reports on not only your sales data but play history, track usage reports and lots more. If you elect to have Audiosparx as your music publisher they will also file and pursue cue sheets for you. If you have a strong library with catchy tunes, good descriptions and keywords they will get your music placed eventually. It's worth mentioning that Audiosparx is not only a licensing company for the entire media industry world-wide. They also distribute music to their partners and affiliates and place your music on CD compilations, digital downloads through places like Amazon, i-Tunes and a few others not to mention their very own Radiosparx internet radio program where contributor's are paid small (very small) percentages for streams. For more information and/or audition, check them out at: https://www.audiosparx.com/sa/alliance/

[Mark Bliss]

EDIT: Crossed posts!

From my second reply in the thread:

You might find some information contacting someone like AudioSparx (there's a bunch of similar companies, cant vouch for any personally.)
http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/company.cfm

http://www.musicsupervisor.com/

http://www.productiontrax.com/

http://www.musicdealers.com/

(Thanks to geo524 for those suggested links. You might PM him as well for more info on the licensing etc, he has some experience there.)

Perhaps geo524 can fill in more details, but my understanding is that there are placement services that attempt to math your content with clients needs.